LARP Element Precedence

tl;dr: someone on the internet has an opinion, it’s got something to do with LARP theory.

[size=150]Introduction[/size]

Having read a whole bunch of debates (some quite old now by the standards of the internet), I’ve come to the conclusion that there is no “right” way to run a LARP. However, there are some things that please certain people more than others when it comes to LARP. There are certain aspects to LARP that define it, such as the immersion, the story (if there is one), the improvisation, the influence on events by the players, and the game or system aspect to it. By no means are these the only defining attributes of LARP, but they are things that are generally found to oppose one-another (unless you have an incredibly inventive LARP writer, of which there are a few).

This is an exploration of agency in LARP. By that I mean; what is important to the LARP, and what influences it (both in creation and in playing). The four aspects that appear to be most popular and most important to people I have asked and reviewed the discussions of are the following; immersion, narrative, game, and player agency. All of these elements come at the sacrifice of the others. These things are explored in the following sections.

[size=150]Immersion[/size]

Immersion in LARP is generally a feeling of how real it is, and how immersed you are in it to the point where disbelief is completely suspended, or there is no suspension if disbelief necessary. There are a great many methods to achieve immersion; from all the props being exactly what they’re meant to be, to hosting the game at a venue that matches the LARP’s setting, to having everyone in the LARP roleplay very strictly in-character and to the norms of the setting, to making the soft-skill system represent similar actions in the real world with similar actions required to perform them.

An ultimate form of immersion would be where everything is exactly what it looks like, and literally does what it is meant to in the setting. Although this sounds a little too close to real life to be very fantastical. Often LARP creators will try and up the immersion without sacrificing the other elements of their LARP. This commonly takes the form of more impressive set dressing, costumes, and props. Another form it can take is where the events in the game are reactions to the actions of the players. There are also many other methods for upping the immersion in LARP.

[size=150]Narrative[/size]

The narrative of a LARP is generally the story that is told by the actions of the players, NPCs, and setting. Achieving narrative can take the form of requiring the players to attempt to achieve a specific ending for their characters, to setting the LARP out into a series of pre-defined scenes, to players reacting in-character in a manner that makes the story more interesting rather than how their character might actually act.

An ultimate form of narrative is where every event is scripted, the outcomes pre-determined, and all the player lines scripted. This makes the people involved sound a lot more like actors than players. Narrative is often pursued as a goal when a specific point is intended to be put across, or a desired story to be told. Without sacrificing the other elements of LARP completely, narrative is generally pursued by using invulnerable NPCs, mixing character background to give the characters and players IC reasons to get involved in the main plot, and by telling the players of events after-the-fact.

[size=150]Game[/size]

The game aspect of a LARP is commonly considered to be inherited from tabletop roleplay, and is represented by systemic representations of things that are difficult to perform in actuality, puzzles, and other things that share similarities with mechanistic arcade games and tabletop roleplay. Gamist approaches to LARP can take the form of systemic or mechanistic character development, and small mini-games or puzzles used instead of actual actions, among others.

An ultimate form of game is where all actions take the form of minigames and everything is dealt with in a systemic manner. This strongly represents board games and arcade games. The game aspect of a LARP is often pursued as a throw over from tabletop, as well as to give OOC satisfaction to those who prefer mind-games, puzzles, and a strategic approach to LARP. Without disposing of the other elements of LARP, gameism takes the common forms of mini-game conflict resolution, unrelated puzzles to do things such as unlock chests, and systemic character development relying on some value system and skill gain or similar that can then be used to influence the game in a systemic manner.

[size=150]Player Agency[/size]

Player agency in LARP is considered to be how much influence the player has on the LARP setting and how important the players are considered to be for the purposes of the LARP. Achieving player agency can take the forms of allowing the players to change aspects of the world to suit their character concept, putting events into the game that are direct setting-responses to the actions of the player, having no NPCs, and/or generally leaving the story up to the players rather than any agency from outside the immediate setting.

The ultimate form of player agency is where the players are the game masters and there are no non-player characters. How enjoyable the event is, or what direction it takes, is then entirely up to the players to decide and create. Player agency is often pursued by introducing NPCs that are detailed in a characters background, or by allowing the players to directly influence the course of events in the LARP, or by having all of the characters within the game played by players.

[size=150]Immersionist vs Gamist[/size]

I have seen a lot of people who value immersion complaining about those who treat LARP as if it were a game, and those who treat it as a game generally ignoring the immersion or saying it is unimportant. The higher the immersion, the less system or soft-skills you will find in a LARP. The higher the game attribute, the more distractions you will have from the immersion. Immersionist and Gamist approaches to LARP, whether from a player perspective or a GM perspective, are in direct competition. That is, however, not to say that you cannot have one without the other.

[size=150]Narrativist vs Playerist[/size]

A lot of games that focus on producing a certain story generally take away from the agency of the players. The more a particular storyline is attempted to be achieved, the less influence the players have in determining what they do and what happens in the setting. Narrativist and Playerist approaches to LARP are in direct competition with each other. Although again, you can have both being prominent in a LARP.

[size=150]Between Immersion and Player Agency[/size]

Immersion and Player Agency work together well, in that ultimate player agency is not necessarily un-immersing, and ultimate immersion does not necessarily detract from player agency. A mix of the two could take the form of a LARP that has accurate set dressing, props, and costumes, and allows the players to dictate the course of events by providing setting-reactions to the actions of the players towards NPCs.

[size=150]Between Player Agency and Game[/size]

Player Agency and a Gamist approach to LARP are not in conflict, and can work very well together. Providing a systemic way in which the players can influence the LARP setting and other characters is an enabling way to give agency to the players. Somewhere between the two sits systemic character development, systemic character influence, influential mini-games, and similar.

[size=150]Between Game and Narrative[/size]

Game and Narrative are things that have commonly been combined, both in and outside of LARP. Games can be made part of the story, or sit completely aside from it, as these two aspects are not in competition. A LARP that incorporates both these aspects may feature a game as part of the main story, mini-games to unlock the next segment of the plot, or a generally more strategic approach to story progression.

[size=150]Between Narrative and Immersion[/size]

Narrative and Immersion can work very well together, if combined in such a way that one adds to the other. Within LARP, a poor narrative can kill the immersion, and poor immersion can distract from the story. A LARP somewhere between the two that combines both elements could contain mood lighting and set dressing to emphasise the mood of the current scene, or an event that fits with the overarching story and blends with the rest of the setting seamlessly. These things can work well to compliment each other, but when in dissonance, can destroy one-another.

[size=150]Conclusion[/size]

Most of these elements can work together in such a way that they benefit each other, or at least do not detract from one-another. Each of them is something that some people prefer, but not everyone. In a place where there is more supply than demand, you may need to run a game that is tailored to the preferences of the community in order to attract players. In places where there is more demand than supply, you have a greater opportunity to experiment and set a precedent in relation to these 4 aspects of LARP (and all the other aspects too!). Although as long as the LARPing community in your area has enough people, you could run almost any kind of LARP and attract players who are interested in that sort of LARP.

If you’re incredibly inventive, I’m certain that the aspects I have proposed as opposing can be combined to work harmoniously. However, it’s a lot easier to create a LARP that does not try to force these oppositions together.

[/2c]
Your thoughts?

That’s someone who surely likes making categories. :wink:

I’d say that for the Immersionist school, you don’t have to be really into set dressing. You can get some really serious emotional immersion by focusing on creating a safe space and giving people room to trust each other OOC.

[quote=“Stephanie”]That’s someone who surely likes making categories. :wink:

I’d say that for the Immersionist school, you don’t have to be really into set dressing. You can get some really serious emotional immersion by focusing on creating a safe space and giving people room to trust each other OOC.[/quote]

How could you tell? :wink:

Yes, I’ve seen some amazing immersion created through emotion, and it’s a really appealing way to do it as well!

I love immersion =3.
Not really much else to add… Interresting wall of text though =D.

[quote=“Tetrajak”][quote=“Stephanie”]That’s someone who surely likes making categories. :wink:

I’d say that for the Immersionist school, you don’t have to be really into set dressing. You can get some really serious emotional immersion by focusing on creating a safe space and giving people room to trust each other OOC.[/quote]

How could you tell? :wink:

Yes, I’ve seen some amazing immersion created through emotion, and it’s a really appealing way to do it as well![/quote]

There is too much emphasis on immersion here - this is not an old country - we don’t have castles, we don’t have old houses - hell we barely have a museum. I think people started getting over the immersion ideal a little. I know most of you have fantastic imaginations so that when a GM tells you that the area of the domain is the in (indicating an outside rectangular area that is in fact a lawn) and people roll with it so much so that people still say “It’s raining - lets head to the inn.” and then ACTUALLY head to the open air inn with rain pouring in on them…

Immersion is nice - but it is in my opinion - massively overrated.

Give me a wall and i will present you with a holo screen and the grafic visualisation of the security systems you just turned on to save every one from the zombies gunning down an entire family because the father broke into the house and chased after the children. I know this works with the right people- Hannah acted fantastically and acted as if she was about to throw up at what she had done - every one else turned away from the screen (blank brick wall) in disgust.

Give me good role players with a good imagination (like the players of starwars) and nothing is impossible. We turned Cornwall park into everything from a zombie infested city to wild bush and finally sewers all in one game.

I ow my players a lot - time to work on a day game I feel…

I think what you are discribing is immersion, but what you are really pointing out is that good players with good imaginations don’t need lots of props to become immersed in the scene. The imagination can achieve far more than a thousand prop makers ever could.

Players, ST’s and the imagination they bring with them make the game, not the props.

Note: I’m not saying that the props don’t help, and having the right props and the right location help enhance a game, but without the players you have nothing.

I realise a lot of weight is put on immersion by a lot of people, but I too am glad for the imaginations present in the players in NZ! It’s true that we don’t have the more impressive venues to run games in, and the ability of the players to turn the few venues we do have into a whole lot of different settings is a great tool indeed.

lolz pretty long, started reading, skipped some at the end

It’s hard finding good venues in New Zealand, if you’re after castles or a fantasy or medieval feel. As Adam says, a good imagination goes a long way.

However, if you’re after beautiful outdoor settings, streams and woodlands, caves etc. We have some pretty good venues available. I found an excellent venue to represent Hell for a day game that was really only missing the fire and brimstone.

From what I hear, the terrified minds of the participants likely filled in that gap pretty well …

The Hell game easily qualifies as most traumatic game ever. Feel free to take Derek up on any offers to repeat a game in that venue if you’re no bigger than he is and quite fit. I got stuck at two points just getting down there.

Having said that, once you get down there, it’s really quite beautiful as long as you aren’t being tortured by demons. The players really weren’t in the best position to enjoy it. :wink:

I agree that imagination and willingness to engage with a story are the two most important elements in bringing a world to life, but I for one appreciate everyone’s efforts to make that transition as easy as possible. Boy do I wish we had castles and such, but we don’t, so we do what we can.

I was not one of the people willing to rush to the “outdoor Inn in the domain” when it started raining. I think I said something like “No, the Inn is leaking horribly, I’m staying under this tree.” I guess my imagination isn’t that good. :wink:

Well, there is offcourse the option of throwing money in a pot and using it to build stuff/buy terrain for general LARP events… though that’d be hellishly expensive, and probably require a bit more than just that =3. And the buildings’d probably not be of stone. But then again, many civilisations build with wood!

lolz pretty long, started reading, skipped some at the end[/quote]

I’m a bit confused. Is this something Tetrajak has written, or something he found on the web, and is quoting it here without reference to its source?

lolz pretty long, started reading, skipped some at the end[/quote]

I’m a bit confused. Is this something Tetrajak has written, or something he found on the web, and is quoting it here without reference to its source?[/quote]

Sorry for the lack of clarity, it’s something I wrote as a result of research into ways to achieve the things listed in the write-up that I thought I’d share.

So out of curiousity, were you referencing GNS theory in this? It’s a model originally developed for tabletop roleplaying which figured that the primary modes were Gamist, Narrativist and Simulationist, although I’ve read an article discussing how GNS worked with larps and suggested adding Immersionist and a Finnish (I think?) word that pretty much worked out as Emotional Immersion.

GNS theory was a banned party conversation a few years ago. It was an incredibly popular topic for a handful of people. I think it had a good death. :smiling_imp:

Not really referencing GNS theory in this one, although some of the terms were usefully borrowed. I think GNS is incorrect, although I guess you could call my analysis something along those lines if you wanted to relate to the similar terms of reference.

From what I read, those who had over analysed LARP and the GNS model came up with a lot of category names for different kinds of immersion, as if immersion were the main goal of LARP. I’m in disagreement with them, and think that LARP can be approached from many different angles for many different goals and pulled off in many different ways. I’m quite happy to cater for gamists, immersionists, narrativists, and playerists all in one game, and I’m certainly going to try.

Sorry, not quite sure what the point of this is. It’s very long and I started skimming toward the end. But it seems like you’re trying to come up with some kind of fail-proof, master-formula for successful LARP. There’s no such thing.

But here’s a short, simple formula that seems to have worked for many people who can regularly be counted on to run high-quality games people have fun at:

Write or select a game you’d enjoy bringing to life. Run said game. If players had fun game = success. If not, use constructive feedback to create a different/better game. Repeat.

[quote=“amphigori”]Sorry, not quite sure what the point of this is. It’s very long and I started skimming toward the end. But it seems like you’re trying to come up with some kind of fail-proof, master-formula for successful LARP. There’s no such thing.

But here’s a short, simple formula that seems to have worked for many people who can regularly be counted on to run high-quality games people have fun at:

Write or select a game you’d enjoy bringing to life. Run said game. If players had fun game = success. If not, use constructive feedback to create a different/better game. Repeat.[/quote]

No need to apologise, I don’t anticipate many people will actually read the whole thing.

That formula is certainly one I use, this little experiment was something of an extension of that for when I get down to deciding some of the more detailed pieces of a game.

Of the 4 things that were listed in the first post, I rate them in order
1 Game
2 Player Agency
3 Narrative
4 Immersion

The game is why most people are there. most people like to know that their actions and play and actually mean something, narrative provides the plot and immersion is for those who are way to serious about the whole venture

I have tried LRP in just about every variation of order over the years, but I always found that the above order had the most players and produced the most fun for everyone.

[quote=“Alista”]Of the 4 things that were listed in the first post, I rate them in order
1 Game
2 Player Agency
3 Narrative
4 Immersion

The game is why most people are there. most people like to know that their actions and play and actually mean something, narrative provides the plot and immersion is for those who are way to serious about the whole venture

I have tried LRP in just about every variation of order over the years, but I always found that the above order had the most players and produced the most fun for everyone.[/quote]

This is indeed an approach which is popular in NZ, if the Auckland campaign attendance numbers are anything to go by.