Swedish LARP's!

Hello guys and gals of the other side of the world :wink:
I’am a 19 year old LARPer from Sweden (in northern Europe, that I guess most of you are aware of, but some people keep thinking I’am talking about Switzerland, which is something entirely different…).

Actually, I just wanted to say hello, but maybe it also would be a nice opportunity to see if LARP in Sweden and New Zeeland are in some ways similiar, or if they are entirely different things :unamused:

I could start by telling you some of the basics in the Swedish LARP-culture:

First of all, in Sweden we don’t call it LARP, we call it ā€œLajvā€ (pronounced as ā€œliveā€). Thats a little bit of a joke with the english word ā€œliveā€ and the fact that it is ā€œlive role playingā€. Well, you have to understand the finer part of the Swedish language to get the fun in it I guess, better don’t try to bring that up here and now… :wink:).

We uses the expressions ā€œOFF-lajvā€ and ā€œIN-lajvā€. When you are OFF, you are not in the game, you are yourself. When you are IN, you are in the game, you are your charakter. One most Swedish LARP are you supposed to be IN-lajv from the start of the LARP to the end of it. Most people sleeps OFF-lajv, in a nowmal sleeping bag or so, but your tent have to look quite IN-lajv from the outside. Like, if you have a normal, say [color=violet]pink[/color] (;)), tent, you have to cover it very well with some neutral-looking cotton-fabric or something similiar, so it at least reasembles the look of a medieval tent.
Outside the tent, nothing should look OFF-lajv, that is considered quite disrespectful against all the other LARPers because, for an example, some red plasticbag would certainly destroy the illusion of being in a medieval kind of world.

A typical LARP in Sweden is set in some fantasy-medievalinspired world, evolutioned by the LARP’s arrangers/organizers. Its quite normal with 100 -300 participants, but twice a year the LARP society ā€œThe Unicornā€ (Enhƶrningen) arranges a bigger LARP in their Eleria-campaign, wich normally has ~1000-1200 participants.
Most LARP’s last from friday evening to sunday around noon, but the big Unicorn-larps last from thursdag to sunday. In the summer it’s not very uncommon to have larps that last up to 7 days.

Normally the players apply to the LARP like one month before it begins. They have to send in their OFF-lajv information, like their names, their e-mail adress and so on, so the arrangers may contact them. They also have to send in information of wich role/character they are thinking about playing on the LARP. That would be a name of the character, a background story of the character and some description of how the character is as person (like does he have any special behaviour, do he fear something special, is he clumsy when it comes to women or what ever).

Normally you can play several different kinds of characters on the LARPs, like humans, wood elf’s, drow elf’s, dark elf’s, orch’s and so on.
The arrangers decides if the different races exists in their LARP-world, some arranges even makes up their own races. Normal is also that the arrangers explain their view of the different races on their website so the players knows how to play their character in the game.
A common problem, expecially after the moveiversions of LotR, is that people thinks that ā€œWow, can’t we go to a LARP like orch’s, and kill like everything, like real LotR-orch’s?ā€. The problem is that this doesn’t really work in the game, how fun is it with a race who just want to kill everything. LARP-orch’s have to be something a bit different, otherwise the whole LARP will be just a matter of ā€œkillingā€ lots of people for the pure sake of ā€œkillingā€.

When we are on the subject: The battle isn’t a very big part of the Swedish LARP’s. It’s normally cosidered very childish to just run around and have fight’s, and thats also uncommon that people does. If your character is ready to risk his/her life for something, it’s gotta be VERY important, you don’t go off and fight someone for the sake of fun, thats simply not tolerated. In Sweden we have a word for that kind of battle, ā€œ[color=red]Boffer[/color]ā€ (wich comes from the ā€œboffingā€ sound of these old weapons made with silvertape, which no one uses in Sweden these days. Novadays all weapons are made with a glassfibrestaff as frame, some plastic material and then painted with latex mixed with some silvercolor). To be a ā€œboffrerā€ it’s not something anyone wants to be, to express it mildly… :wink:

Now I have mostly played human roles (and orch twice), but what does then a common human do in a little village on a LARP?
I will make an example from a quite small LARP (100 participants) me and some friends attended two weeks ago.
We werent very prepared in our roles or anything, but we made up this little story that we were four young men working on two farms in the district, Gote (me) and Tryggve from the Backbo farm and Enok and Eke from the Gunnebo farm. The relations between these farms were a bit… Straind, if you say so :stuck_out_tongue: We didn’t hate each other, but both the farms were in argument with the fact that THEIR farm were the best farm in the district, and these lazy crofters of the other farm weren’t much to have, no no!

In short, we spent the larp singing, drinking cider (alcohol free, most Swedish larps were minors may participate have an alcohol free police) and miscredited the guys from the other farm. "Hey, you know what the girls says about the boys on the Gunnebo Farm? ā€˜It wasn’t long, but is was THIN!’ " was a very common saying from the Backbo Farm-side, aimed at the fact that the Gunnebo boys according to us had the rumor around them of having small… Equipment… :laughing:.
We had som nice ā€œfist-fightsā€ (we didn’t hurt each other OFF-lajv… :wink:) with those Gunnebo bastards, making it very clear for anyone to see that Backbo was the biggest, best and beautifulest farm in the whole country 8) A real farm-helpers fight if you say so.

Talking about singing, thats something I did a lot of one the last LARPS I’ve attended. Nothing is like sitting on the lokal ā€œinnā€, drinking lots of beer and cider (alcohol free, but it doesnt matter, if you may ā€œplayā€ that you are a man from the medieval, you can ceratinly altso ā€œplayā€ that you are drunk 8)) and singing lots of funny medieval-inspired songs. Then you actually gets the feeling of ā€œmedieval livingā€, the farmers sitting on the taverna in the night, having a good time and refuses to accept that they have to get up and work tomorrow… :wink:


Now I consider myself as a bit conservative when it come to this, but when I go to a LARP, I want to create an illusion of being in another world, in another time.
I finds it hard to keep that illusion up if there are OFF-lajv things laying around. I don’t want to see material like plastic, and I definitively don’t want to hear someone talking OFF-lajv (like talking about cellphones, cars and everything else that belongs to the modern world).
For my part, I want to be IN-lajv 24 hour/day. Me and my friends have sewn a big medeieval looking pavilion (click to see picture)and also a smaller tent (click to see picture), so we sleep IN-lajv (with wool blankets and sheep fur’s), cooks food IN-lajv (a small campfire, a cauldron, some meat and vegetables and it’s fixed!) and well, simply ARE IN-lajv 24h 8) Great fun I have to say, much more feeling than if you, for an example, are being OFF-lajv inside the tent and so on.

Just think that you are sitting in the sunset, cooking some food and smooking a pipe, all around you can see the thin smokepillars from peoples campfires. There are some special feeling in the village when the day are about to turn into night, people are sitting and eating, there are som ā€œcalm before the stormā€, my favourite time of day on a LARP I have to say :slight_smile:
[color=red]
[size=150]Now, which is the differences compared to New Zeeland larps?[/size][/color]

Well, now I have babbled for eternity, hope anyone have the energy to read it all… :blush:
At last I just want to share some of my LARP-pictures taken after some LARP’s I’ve attended the last two years (have taken hundreds of LARP pictures, if you want more, just add me on MSN, martin.arleskar@telia.com ) The pictures --> http://album.fotolabo.net/altiapp/amp/amp.fcg?GSTLOGIN=&ALBUMID=IcG4wOJxgN&PASSWD=IcGJnS3DAM&LANG=se

Greetings!
Martin ArleskƤr, Sweden

Hey mate,

There’s a fair amount of variety in NZ larp, so we can’t make absolute statements about what it’s like. Your description of Swedish games is familiar to me, and it’s a style of game that I’d probably enjoy. Although I’d prefer to have a break from playing one style and genre of game all the time.

I’d say that some NZ larp is similar in its aspirations to Swedish larp. Mordavia, for example, has high goals for immersion, appearances, staying in character, etc. But then, I can’t say how it would compare in terms of actual play. Sometimes people here drop out of character (ā€œOOCā€, which means the same as your ā€œoff-lajvā€), and there is lots of visual stuff that could be improved to look more in-character (ā€œICā€). But in general, the same principle is being followed.

On the other hand, there are games here that don’t fuss about appearances so much. They just focus on playing characters or having fun, sometimes without costume. I’d say that’s becoming a bit less common, but I don’t have a complete picture of it.

Your pics look good, nice costumes.

I’ve heard many things about Dragonbane. Is that something you’re going to?

I think it’s probably accurate to say the games here are probably smaller. We also don’t have any venues set up specifically for LARPing. There are no rustic villages we can go to and no medieval ruins.

I also most enjoy the sitting around the campfire, singing and dancing.

Unless you considered somewhere like Howick historical village as a potential LARP arena (potential game?), there are very few recreated places. The village isnt even for LARP, infact, I dont know quite what it’s for.
The SIZE of your LARPs sounds amazing. It tempts me to learn the language and attend one. Perhaps I could just turn up and pretend to be a foreigner (which i think i could do quite nicely.)
It sounds like there is much less emphasis on the combat side of LARP over there, another thing that I am quite intrigued by.

Tell me more!

Hi again :slight_smile:
Sorry that I havent been able to answer for a while.

About specific LARP-villages I can say that well, there are a few here i Sweden, but they are certainly quite small. Not lika 50 houses if you say so, more like five :wink: Normally the games are set in some forest somewhere, without houses and stuff.

Talking about Dragonbane; in case anyone didn’t know that is a international LARP arranged mostly by some guys from Finland, but it takes place in Sweden. http://www.dragonbane.org is their website.
I don’t think I will participate in this game, mainly because of the cost. It costs like 1200 Swedish Crowns (208 New Zeeland dollars), and then you haven’t countered the cost of traveling to the LARP (it is arranged in another part of Sweden).
Normally a Swedish LARP costs something between 100 and 450 SEK (17-75 NZ dollar), so Dragonbane is quite expensive yes.
Well, I guess you must have in mind that they are building a smaller village for this specific LARP and that they have a fantastic gamearea (never earlier touched by human hands, more or less), but money is money.
What does a typical New Zeeland LARP cost?

The game itself will maybe not be exactly like normal Swedish games (it is arranged by people from Finland so… :stuck_out_tongue:) but it will certainly be nice. There will be 500-800 participants (or so I’ve heard).

Talking about the sizes of our LARPs, so well, for an example the german LARPs are quite much bigger… :stuck_out_tongue: Conquest of Mythodea (in Germany) had 3200 participants this year.
The thing is that there the focus seems to be like 99% on the battle, everyone is there to fight it seems (some of my friends went down to Germany and participated in the game in a sort of exchange projekt with an Italian/German LARP-group called Ordo Solis, http://www.ordosolis.org. They visited one of our big Unicorn-LARPs, and then my friends went to Germany for CoM).

I have nothing agains serious battle, but it seems quite unrealistic that everyone in a LARP plays some sort of warriors. Well, if the game illuminates a battle, sure, but CoM had a real village where people lived and so on, but sometimes everyone just gathered their weapons and went to the battle, like, for fun. It is certainly lots of fun, but not very IN character if you ask me. Which normal human would gladly (several times a day!) risk his life in a big battle? :laughing:

Its a ā€œLiving Museum.ā€ http://www.fencible.org.nz/main.htm

I had a look at what it would cost to hire out so we could run a larp…

Are you sitting down?

$1000/day.

[quote=ā€œScottyā€]Its a ā€œLiving Museum.ā€ http://www.fencible.org.nz/main.htm

I had a look at what it would cost to hire out so we could run a larp…

Are you sitting down?

$1000/day.[/quote]

I wonder if LARPS could negotiate that down, being a non-profit org and potentially wanting to use it more than once. Negotiation is often a possibility, especially if you emphasis that it’d be educational (you’d be aiming to recreate the period). Or alternatively we could apply for a grant from a local body to help pay for the venue, if we ran an event there that was historically based (and thus both cultural and educational).

Some bits like this are totally sweet:

fencible.org.nz/avillagelife/sodcottage.htm

Otherwise, if we got 40 people to a game there it’d be… $25 each just for the venue. Which isn’t so awful. Although having said that, you’d be spending a bit on costumes and props too, and probably some on food.

I wonder if this might be a good setting for that colonial/Maori LARP concept that was discussed on the Mordavia forum. By focussing on the colonists and not having a marae in the game, it might be less politically sensitive. It’d also be easier to run a game with mostly Pakeha and a few Maori, in terms of demographics.

[quote=ā€œMartin the Swedeā€]Talking about Dragonbane; in case anyone didn’t know that is a international LARP arranged mostly by some guys from Finland, but it takes place in Sweden. http://www.dragonbane.org is their website.
I don’t think I will participate in this game, mainly because of the cost. It costs like 1200 Swedish Crowns (208 New Zeeland dollars), and then you haven’t countered the cost of traveling to the LARP (it is arranged in another part of Sweden).[/quote]

I was booked in to to Dragonbane this year, before it was postponed. I thought it was cheap for a week-long game in a specially-made village with all food included. It would have been a hell of a lot cheaper than the rest of the places I stayed while on holiday. :wink:

For a weekend-long game, around $40 to $80.

Hello larp friends on the other side of the world! :wink:

I am from Sweden also and have larp experience since 1991, and have seen a lot of interesting larps.

I can agree with Martin a bit of the description of general image of Swedish larps, But about fighting I don’t agree smiles
A fight is boring if its starts with out reason, and that we call ā€œbofferā€ but a fight starting with reason can be really interesting and make dramatic consequences for the whole larp.
In this year I was on CoM www.mythodea.de in Germany, and it was a big international larp with more then 3200 participants… and there you could be in big glorious battles al day, ore be in the great town of 2000 citizens. So… it had the best parts of two worlds… great armies and great plots and diplomacy in the town.

Dragonbane… is a larp I wouldn’t go to, for the moment. If they can make it more trustfully I maybe change opinion. So for the moment I only goes to three larps each year ( and then I don’t counts my members larps) and that is Kastaria (see a private photo gallery: digitalbild.net/album/showal … 025617f547 )
Ore I generally goes to association Unicorn (in Swedish: Enhorningen) and theirs big larp Eleria campaign (see photo: enhorn.com/bildarkiv/bild_arkiv.asp?Lajv=200 )

But the big larp for me is CoM and the fee for participants how are coming from another country is about 42 Euro. And if some one here wants to know more about it, you can email me fredrik@lajvsverige.se
Ore visit our international forum page lajvsverige.se/forum/viewforum.php?f=33

About larp on New Zeeland
My view is most about the Mordavia larp, and my opinion is that you are doing great high fantasy larps… and I like it! =)
You seem to have the thoughts about to do fantasy to reality, and make it good… and in the other side here in Sweden are going to do every thing so realistic, and so boring with no fantasy creature… only what I feel.
I think that larp in New Zeeland have an advantage about you environment to do settings with good creations how can make people around the globe to be interested to come…
Ore do I have wrong about it? =)

friendly regards

[quote=ā€œScottyā€]Its a ā€œLiving Museum.ā€ http://www.fencible.org.nz/main.htm

I had a look at what it would cost to hire out so we could run a larp…

Are you sitting down?

$1000/day.[/quote]

well, i wa sitting down, and fell of my chair.

Thats to rich for Circle blood I’m afraid. I have trouble convinving the treasurer to part with money for new props, he woudl have fit if i told him the cost of that. His little hands would clench into fists, and he woudl stamp his tiny feet. Well, not really, he is bigger than me, but you get the idea.

R

I think of Mordavia as low fantasy rather than high fantasy. I’m not sure what other poeple use low/high to differentiate between them but Mordavia is a blood and mud type of game where good doesn’t always triumph over evil. I think of that as ā€œlowā€ whereas I’d consider a game where beautiful tanned heroes heroicly slew overwhelming hoards of evil minions to be ā€œhighā€ā€¦

I used to prefer fantasy to historical. Then I read some history books and realized that it’s true what they say. ā€œReality IS stranger than fiction!ā€

The advantage of doing historical games is there are books which show clothing, armour, weapons etc that people can research. They can strive for a level of excellence that cannot be measured in a fantasy setting.

The disadvantage is the temptation to try to convince everyone else they must similarly strive towards this level of excellence… :smiley:

I’ve found out something interesting about the Swedish LARP culture, again… :wink:
I have always considered the Nordic (Sweden, Norway and Finland, and maybe also Danmark) LARP scene as more grown up, realistic, with ā€œbetter equipmentā€ and so on than the ā€œcontinental LARP sceneā€ (say Germany, French, Belgium, Italy).

The thing I found out is that everything has to do with the specific countries/regions reenactment scene.
The western and southern parts of Europe have a very welldeveloped reenactmentscene, with many societies doing everything from sewing historically correct clothes (a tunic model 1206 someone?) to cooking medieval food.
The LARPers down there are then much more aimed at the fantasy adventure. ā€œIf you wants to recreate the medieval, become an reenactor!ā€. The LARPs seem to be much more like ordinary role playing games, with lots of rules (Specific hitpoints for your armour parts, possibillity to rise in ā€œlevelā€ and so on), lots of magic, heroes, fantasy creatures, epic battles. In Sweden we call this (actually in a bit of negative meaning) high fantasy.

In the Nordic countries we never had any strong reenactor scene. If you ask someone in the street if he has any idea of what reenactment is most people will give you a confused look and say ā€œNo, I don’tā€. If you ask someone if he knows what LARP is most people will at least recognise the term (ā€œWell, something with people in medieval clothes running around in the forestā€), many people you even know someone that is LARPing (mainly if you ask younger people).

The whole thing is that the nordic LARP scene has been shouldering the burden of the (missing) reenactment scene, which is novadays beginning to grow steadily. Therefore, the developement of the nordic (especially the Swedish I think…) LARP scene between 1995 and 2005 has steadily pointed at becoming more realistic, more ā€œhistoricalā€ (even if regular LARPs set in a historical medieval time are few) and most of all less fantasy.
A developement even I have noticed since I started with LARP spring 2003 is that the amount of Low Fantasy LARPs (in Sweden that often means that there is a village with humans and some folklore creatures in the forest, never any orches, dark elves and so on) are steadily increasing, and the amount of High Fantasy LARPs are steadily decreasing.

This very morning I wrote a post on the http://www.lajvsverige.se-forum regarding the fact that as soon someone asks something like ā€œMay I have this or this equipment on LARPsā€ the answer is ā€œNo, there were no such thing in the medievalā€. <-- SO? 99% of the LARPs in Sweden aren’t medieval, they are medievalinspired fantasyLARPs. If the organizer (game master) of the LARP decides that you can bring a specific equipment (this time it was some old pistol alĆ” 1650) because it exists in there LARP world, so be it.

Too many people seem to think that they at the same time may tell people that ā€œThat didn’t exist in the medieval!ā€ and then themselves show up on LARPs dressed in something they think are ā€œmedievalā€, but in fact is totally incorrect. Most LARP-clothes I have seen in my life looks a lot more like 1500-1600 clothes, with some touch of something that never existed at all in known human history = Fantasy.

[color=red]
So, after this 300page novel of babbling about problems in the Swedish LARP-culture ( :laughing: ) I wonder if you are having any similiar problems? And most of all, do your country have a relatively strong reenactment scene, e.g. do people recognise the world reenactment better than the term LARP?[/color]

Well, re-enactment has been around for a couple of decades now so we don’t need Larp to soak people with a historical accuracy bent although there’s a reasonable crossover. Re-enactment groups vary between the ones that are mostly about fighting and the ones that are into craft or music and dance. They also vary between the ones where people care about how accurate their underwear is (I’m thinking of you, Derek, as I write this :wink:) and the ones where a reasonable effort to not look out of place is OK. There’s a lot of variety, so people can look around and find what they like.

Do the general public recognise the term re-enactment better than Larp? I have no idea actually, I never really asked. The people at work tend to generalise my hobbies under the category ā€œSteph’s Lord of the Ring’s stuffā€, and don’t bother making any more distinctions than that.

Steph

Hey all you foreigners out there! :wink:
Yep, yet another swede has come to your site babbling about just how fancy and great we swedes are doing fantastic larps… well… at least i hope i won’t come to that :wink:

The name is Petter not Peter and i have a great interest in larping and my home-cooked makizushi.

[quote=ā€œMartin the Swedeā€]The game itself will maybe not be exactly like normal Swedish games (it is arranged by people from Finland so… :stuck_out_tongue:) but it will certainly be nice. There will be 500-800 participants (or so I’ve heard).
[/quote]
Actually Martin Its a joint group of estonias, swedes, finnish larpers and some another nationalitys to that is bringing the projekt to the deep and beautifal forests of Ƅlvdalen.

…by the way, if you want to get impressed, check the scenery of whats already been built at www.dragonbane.org
That’s some really nice longhouses.

Then back to the always so exiting discussion of reenactment vs. larp.
Well, I have to say that this year I really learned myself I lesson when speaking to a lot of swedish reenacters. Quite a big number of the is or has been larpers. Many of them saw larp as one nice thing and a reenactment as another.

No need to get all nemesis-speaking about the hobbies while you can combine the crafting and culture knowledges of the reenacting world implemted on a medievel or fantasy-medieval style larp with your nobleman-manners and freck’n awsome 1380:s knight armour and clothes.

Then when it gets to the point when people argue that there hobby is much better than the others…i just look in another direction and turn of the volume of my ipod.

I’m pretty sure the Victorians would disagree with you, if they were still alive.

I have a theory that re-enactment has pretty much always gone on. Maybe not during some of the big wars, but I think people always credit there own generations with more imagination that the previous ones.

I agree. I take my LARPing a lot less ā€œseriouslyā€ than my medieval stuff. But only in terms of what I strive for. With the medieval re-enactment, I’ll happily spend a few days researching the right type of buckle to attach to my spurs (and then order them from overseas for $45.00). But with LARPing I can throw a complete costume together in an evening or two…

That is disturbingly erotic and I shan’t be able to concentrate for the rest of the day. :smiley:

I’m pretty sure the Victorians would disagree with you, if they were still alive.[/quote]The current re-enactment movement in New Zealand has been active for a couple of decades now. Ya wanna year? The first club that I know of was founded in 1983. Whatever the Victorians were doing, they didn’t leave any continuity. I know of no clubs that can say ā€œSirrah, we can trace our club’s ancestry to the Indian Mutiny.ā€ That’s what I meant.

Stephanie

That is disturbingly erotic and I shan’t be able to concentrate for the rest of the day. :smiley:[/quote]

Well… accurate or not… this year I went to a larp that went on for about 5 days and for the first time I used only IC clothes… the feeling of linen underwear instead of the usual boxers surely made me feel more IC… so don’t underestimate the power of your briefs.

I understand. I have many pairs of linen underwear, seperate woollen hose, hand stitched turn shoes etc… I often wear this type of thing LARPing, because it’s easier than making a new costume specific to my character, and I tend mostly to play NPCs which often don’t last long enough to invest much effort/time in creating a unique costume for.

Just a tip for all you islanders… unrealitiesofmine.blogspot.com/2 … ntasy.html - An article divided in two parts about nordic larping written by Jonas BarkĆ„.