[quote=“Derek”]
I believe that if someone lacks the social courage to call a hold in a combat situation when they perceive they are in danger that they should not be at the game.[/quote]
I know this, however what should happen, and what actually happens are two different things.
You can’t look into someone’s mind, and say “Yea, this person is going to yell out when something makes this person uncomfortable, or is dangerous to said person” and look into another person’s mind and say "This one isn’t."
Hell, people can’t even judge that of themselves sometimes. You’re bound to find people who will join live combat games, without the courage to stop the situation they’re in OOCly for their own safety. And it’s inconsiderate to just say “They shouldn’t be in there to begin with”.
On the flip side, I’m not saying it’s other player’s responsibility to take care of the people without the courage to yell out, I’m just saying it’d be nice if you could look out for it. Not an obligation, a suggestion to each player =).
That would be a breach of the health and safety clause of the NZLARPS Code of Conduct.
I want to repeat what a lot of sensible people who’s opinion I value, and who’s position I share.
If I accidentally injured anyone in a Larp, perhaps with a stray arrow, or knocking someone over when fleeing combat, or any other easy to imagine scenario I’d feel pretty dreadful for a while.
If someone with a pre-existing condition accidentally suffered permanent damage because of my actions, that would sit with me for the rest of my life. I’d constantly wonder if I should have done something differently.
I don’t believe anybody can offer this assurance.[/quote]
You’re quite correct of course. And I accept that.
The context of my statement is of worsening or making permanent a pre-existing condition.
[quote=“joker”]Thanks Kara.
You managed to largely put into words a chunk of my concerns.[/quote]
Mine too. Don’t get in involved in the physical element of the game (honestly, there is no reason that you have to) that will put you at risk, enjoy the myriad of other aspects of the game that you’ve turned up to participate in.
Headbands will help to make sure that people don’t hit you and take care with you, but take responsibility for yourself too.
And sure, some people will be stopped by this, others won’t.
Making something a rule doesn’t guarantee it being followed.
[quote=“Derek”]As a slight aside – Larp weapons really aren’t very dangerous – I honestly believe you’re more at risk from someone running in to you in the dark or from slipping over on a dark forest path than you are from being injured by an actual weapon.
Pink headbands are all and good but I suspect you’ll find that more people have been injured with twisted knees and ankles than any larp weapon related injuries.
The “live action” part of larp isn’t just the bit with rubber swords.[/quote]
The worst injuries I had was having my head collide with another person, both of us running after someone. A ‘don’t fight me’ mechanic isn’t going to stop someone panicking in the heat of the moment, or slipping, or running into someone, and so forth, and injuring themselves as a result.
More important than a get-out-of-combat ability is having options to do other things at the game, other than fighting. In a choice between WoD games and Skirmish, the option to do other things is a choice of which game to chose (skirmish doesn’t offer overly much else other than combat, and WoD games offer only non-physical gameplay).
For a big event like Chimera and Cruicible, I believe it falls on the organisers to ensure a range of choice is available, or to make it explicitly clear that there is a lack of other things to do for that event. Then, within that event, those who do not want to or cannot participate in live combat scenes are able to participate fully within the game doing any of the many other things available that don’t involve live combat, and having an indication of where to go to avoid being in live combat (e.g. don’t head out to this field or these paths between these times, don’t pick these games at Chimera, etc).
A good place to start is ensuring the rules involve more than just combat-orientated information (which I believe Cruicible has done a steller job at, btw).
My preference for this is also because I don’t usually want my big weekend events to consist solely of live combat, and so having that choice is good for me too.
I think that ultimately the person with the disability needs to decide what they’re capable of doing. Nobody else can or should decide for them.
Games need reasonably full disclosure if they are to be out of the ordinary but we’re all adults here.
[quote=“theotherphoenix”]Continuing the sports analogy, that’s like rocking up to a rugby club and saying “Hey there, I LOVE rugby, I love the social club, I love catching balls, I love scoring points, but I have this disability, so I can’t be tackled. So I’ll have this special uniform and I’ll just hang around waiting to catch the ball and … you know, if you get close enough to tackle me, we can just STOP THE GAME and we’ll talk about it”
Really? Really!?![/quote]
damn you! I was reading your post while I was eating dinner and it made me laugh so hard I spat it all over my keyboard 
I think in future everybody needs to hide their post with Pink text saying [color=#FFBFFF]“KEYBOARD DANGER ALERT: this post might cause laughter”[/color] so we don’t put my keyboard (which is barely on its last legs) in danger!
Anyway, enough silliness. As seriously now, your analogy is spot on! It is unrealistic to expect everything to be suitable for everybody, otherwise it all gets watered down to a lukewarm common denominator that is utterly boring. Let’s just all stay inside and play snakes and ladders, anything else is too dangerous! No, instead let’s just take personal responsibility for the risks involved and if we judge the risk to be too high we just go along and pick something else from the wide range of many joys that life has to offer 
For instance, because I have ankylosing spondylitis I will never play club rugby, this doesn’t bother me too much as I’m not that interested in it! Also for many years it has prevented me from taking up Judo, which I do have an interest in. But boffer larp combat is something which I’ve judged to totally within my capabilities, so I’m giving it a go 
[quote=“Derek”]With SCA combat I don’t believe that the plumes really get noticed as much as you’d hope. I believe that we mostly recognise a valid target by what they’re carrying. If they have shields and/or melee weapons, we hit them. If they have a bow or crossbow, we don’t.
The thing that mostly determines if people hit people in combat is what weapons they are carrying and what they’re doing.
I don’t think pink headbands will work IN combat but I think they will work BEFORE combat as a ‘please don’t attack me’ reminder.
I think in combat we should look at non-combatants raising their hands (the universal sign for surrendering) and heading for a safe spot out of harms way.[/quote]
Good points. What a non-combatant should do in order of priority is:
0) do not engage anybody in combat
- not be holding any kind of weapon
- have some kind of visual reminder (such as the pink headband being discussed)
- put their hands up and get the hell out of the way to a safer distance away
If they follow these four then they’ve gone far in risk minimization!
But mistakes will happen unintentionally and they need to be willing to accept this (just like how a referee will on occasion get tackled by accident once every hundred games or whatever).
You’re eliding a very imporant word there: the exclusion only applies to “competitive” sports. We don’t generally describe our hobby that way, and have spent years stressing the co-operative, non-competitive aspects against traditional gamism. As a result, I do not share Derek’s confidence that it applies.[/quote]
Rugby (or any team sport, such as cycling which is one I’ve done) is a very co-operative activity indeed! Not that dissimilar to a LARP at all.
We have to put this into perspective here, what proportion of the NZ population gets excluded from Rugby (which is nowhere near the toughest spot imaginable)? Then remember we’re setting a threshold for buffer larp at a much much lower level already! It seems pointless to discuss watering it down even more, when we’re already so inclusive.
Indeed. If a person has any doubt about their abilities to do boffer LARP they should not do it (there is still hundreds of other kinds of roleplaying out there), but if they still really want to do it then they should seek out a doctor’s certificate that gives them thumbs up ok.
[quote=“Derek”]As a slight aside – Larp weapons really aren’t very dangerous – I honestly believe you’re more at risk from someone running in to you in the dark or from slipping over on a dark forest path than you are from being injured by an actual weapon.
Pink headbands are all and good but I suspect you’ll find that more people have been injured with twisted knees and ankles than any larp weapon related injuries.
The “live action” part of larp isn’t just the bit with rubber swords.[/quote]
True. I’d suggest the gravest danger to a person is… yourself! (especially when outside in the dark)
The biggest injury I got from the first Crucible day game? It was caused by myself! When I fell down dead a little too overly dramatically and managed to knock myself out for a second!
No big deal, was my own silly self. Had a bit of a sore head, and just took it a bit more easy for the next half hour.
We are a LIVE Role Play game down here. As we tell ALL our players “You are ultimately responsible for your own safety.”