I’ve split this legal discussion from the more general discussion of running a 40K larp here.
Ryan
New Zealand hasn’t used the Privy Council as a final court of appeal since 2004. We eliminated it. By statute[/quote]
Really… thats interesting… shame it sounds like you have no idea what you are talking about.
davidbain.counterspin.co.nz/node/420
December 13, 2003 - Court of Appeal decides a retrial was not needed on the grounds that the new evidence would not have changed the jury’s verdict.
June 7, 2006 - Bain’s legal team wins right to a full Privy Council hearing.
March 8, 2007 - Five-day Privy Council hearing in London begins.
May 10, 2007 - Privy Council delivers decision, ordering a retrial.
May 15, 2007 - Bain granted bail at hearing in Christchurch High Court
- yea… again - ACTS don’t mean ANYTHING - at all. They are just as bullshit as bylaws.
[quote=“Wikipedia”]Proposals to abolish appeals to the Privy Council in New Zealand date back to the early 1980s.[25] It was not until October 2003 that New Zealand law was changed to abolish appeals to the Privy Council in respect of all cases heard by the Court of Appeal of New Zealand after the end of 2003, in favour of a Supreme Court of New Zealand.[/quote]OK, so Wikipedia isn’t exactly an authoratative source. Consider also Section 50(1)(a) of the Statute posted by IdiotSavant, which states:
[quote]50. Privy Council may still determine appeals in certain existing proceedings
(1) The Privy Council may hear and determine, or continue to hear and determine,—
(a) an appeal against a final judgment of the Court of Appeal made before 1 January 2004, or made after 31 December 2003 in a proceeding whose hearing was completed before 1 January 2004, where[/quote]which would make the David Bain case one of the last (if not the last) where the Privy Council could be involved.
None of which is particularly relevant to the IP/Games Workshop argument, I would have thought, except in the most theoretical of senses.
How is it risky? [/quote]
Its legally risky because GW are notorious arseholes, and because they can spend more money on lawyers than you can. The actual merits of a case are sadly only a consideration if you can afford to fight it (which no-one here can).
That doesn’t mean you shouldn’t do it. If you’re considering GMing such a game, you should simply be aware of the risk, judge the probability of its occuring, and have some thoughts on how to respond if indeed the 40,000 ton gorilla decides to take a shit on you. “Better to ask forgiveness than permission” and “ceasing and desisting on request” are not terrible strategies. “Fight it in court” is not, unless you have a very large student loan debt you want to get out of, and no financial plans for the next seven years.
I think someone has already said this but basically I’d speak to the people doing it in the UK and see how/what they do.
It’s a matter of the individual company. Legally, it’s exactly the same whether you’re using 40k, Star Wars, Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings… it’s just a matter of whether the people who own the rights A) find out about it and B) care to stop it.
Many companies, such as Lucasfilm, actively encourage such use of their property as long as there’s no profit - but if they decided that your particular use of their IP was unacceptable, they’d be within their rights to stop you (usually with a friendly cease and desist, rather than going straight to court).
It’s basically the same in the fan film community, which I’ve spent a fair amount of time around - some companies are perfectly fine with it as long as no money changes hands (even paying someone the cost of a blank CD for a CD with a fanfilm burned on it is often cause for a cease and desist), but others will slam down the iron fist the moment they hear about your project. If Games Workshop has a reputation of going after not-for-profit fan projects, then (should they find out) you’re likely to be told to stop.
I’m not sure they do. All the lawsuits I can see are about them suing companies.
It wouldn’t surprise me if they send cease-and-desists to fans using their logos. But there’s no need to use their logos, so it’s fairly simple to avoid infringing on the trademark. Things like settings cannot be trademarked - that’s a question of copyright, and that’s where I’m saying that a larp in the 40K setting would basically be using their RPG product for its intended purpose, so it’s hard to see that they’d have reasonable legal grounds to sue unless you were for-profit.
From dealing with them on this subject in the past I found them pretty easy going, as long as you do not make a profit or do anything that calls their products into disrepute they are generally reasonable and leave you alone.
You could always just post anything official using non copywrited material and anything unofficial can be whatever you want. Call him a “Space Knight” on the rules but allow the players to yell “Space Marine” in the game. GW wouldn’t sue you for yelling Blood for the Blood God before running into battle in teonn, but if you released the “blood for the blood god” special rule, then they could get a bit angry.